It's just so silly, it might work......

[JD74]

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.....and it will !

I just got off the phone with Mike @ Magnafuel...and after about 30 minutes of chat'n, I finally got all the answers I needed to make all of my wildest hopes and dreams (about an easy fuel system) come to fruition.

The 'sketch' above - Got the 'GO AHEAD' from Magnafuel for 1200+ WHP @ 75+ PSI Line Pressure, for daily Driver/Street/Track Car duty.

No fire-trap "swirl pot/surge tank'....and only 1 Pump.
This setup will literally DROWN a set of 6 x 1,000cc Injectors for our application....even @ over 30 PSI of Boost.

The Pump is $520 USD from Magnafuel Direct.

https://www.magnafuel.com

How much easier can it get ?

Also, don't pay any attention to the FITTING SIZES Used.
......they are examples only and larger can/will most likely be used to feed the rail.
(eg. 10AN from Pump to Y, then Dual 8AN to rail ?)

Comments ?

Cheers,
Allan

[NismoS-tune]

Nice work!

I have to comment a bit though, opinion really. You're still on 1 pump from the tank so no backup like a 2 pump system. 1200whp is 2 times what you need unless you run some Q16. You still don't have a fuel anti-surge tank to help in corners. It's a sweet setup though. I wouldn't be going this way as I'd go big single pump with low suction pressure trip switch (fault switch), surge tank and 2 inline pumps to feed my tomei rail. The costs are a bit more but is more reliable though that big pump you're thinking is WAY more powerful/cheaper. Obviously you're not running a stock fuel rail. Will you be running AN line all the way to the front? I don't think factory coppers can do 1200whp let alone 1000?

Just opinions.

Allan, always thinking, good man.

[JD74]

Going this route, I would run 2 new lines (10an feed, 8an return) front to back (with a frame rail mounted Fuel Cooler passthrough on the return line).......

My goal is to stay with a Single Fuel pump...and NO Surge Tank....AT ALL COSTS, even if it meant getting a Custom Built OEM Replacement Fuel Tank (which I still am going to look into, so I can sump it properly and baffle it)........

I don't want the headache of a Multi-Pump System.

[JD74]

Something like this on the Return Line.......

Magnafuel said, the cooler I can keep the fuel, the better and a return line cooler is a good idea for some applications.

[malibusst]

sad to say... its already been done ........ did it for a customers car about a year back....
he used an aeromotive eliminator pump.
-First, yes use a BIG cooler on the system,
-Second, Oem Return is too small... do a -8 return. use the oem return as the vent...
- USE RUBBER MOUNTS for the pump......

- and no offence, but surge tanks are not fire traps, if done right...

[JD74]

I could really care less how well they are done. Surge Tanks, 12 fuel lines, 52 fittings and 6 bloody fuel pumps are gay (a little hyperbole....yes.....).

Now, that Eliminator Pump on the other hand.....fully submersible ? that's sexy.

[malibusst]

yeah that pump was "too much pump" imo... ramp rate on the fuel pressure was hell...

[NismoS-tune]

You don't need 6 pumps on a surge tank or 52 fittings lol. 2 pumps would be minimum, 3 pumps would work well. The factory fuel tank baffles are non existant so cornering hard could starve fuel when getting below 1/2 tank, even with your haultruck sized fuel pump.

A good surge system is not expensive but can cost more than a race fuel. The benefit of a surge tank is an OEM sized fuel tank with uber reliability, even on big cornering with minimal fuel. You could easily build a kickass surge system for less than $1500 with sard bits or probably less than $1000 with ebay

About the multi pump, it's pretty easy with relays/controllers and if you lose a pump, you can get into limp mode (if you made one which isn't too tough) where if you lose your 1200whp pump, it's tow truck time...

you know, like an 040, 2x 044s, (or 4x044 is you're paranoid lol) some lines/fittings, small 2L surge tank and hardware. You can't really beat that. Inventing the wheel was uber smart but it's already been done. I would suggest doing a good surge setup or race cell and calling it a day but since you're running some whack/crazy dry sump, just as well do that crazy 10,000hp single pump.

this is my opinion Merry christmas Allan lol, let me know what you think.

[JD74]

I would take the Tow Truck with a single pump system that fails vs a blown motor caused by a lean condition when a pump fails from a multi-pump system.

[NismoS-tune]

Sorry, what I meant was, if the pressure drops (lets say you lose 1 pump but still have the others) you have have a low pressure switch that can input to your ECU and go into limp or safe mode so you don't need a tow truck and a tow hook or have to take your bumper off. Low pressure trip switches aren't too expensive and they're easy to install. I'm sure the kickass ECU you have has a safe/limp mode input that could be controlled by low oil pressure or fuel pressure switches. It was just an idea anyways. 1 pump is not reliable like multi pump setups. I'm about reliability before cheap cost.

just a thought anyways. I wouldn't mind maybe using something similar to this with my surge tank setup. Let us know how the installation goes!

[JD74]

Last time I even brought up the use of 'Low Pressure' Safety Switches, I was jumped all over and accused of trying to re-invent the wheel by all of the 'minimalists' out there......what a joke.

My build is frankly, the sh1t, regardless of which way I go......and I've got the 'budget' either way, to bail me out of whatever stupid direction I begin to go in, or situation I find myself in....so I am not really THAT worried about it.

I will double and tripple up on stupid things such as safety devices and enhancement pieces, to make myself feel better about things.....BUT WHAT I WILL NOT DO IS run more than 1 Fuel Pump. It's as simple as that.

A Dual Pump failover System ? BRING IT ON.

A Dual or Tripple 'pumping' system - NOT A CHANCE.

[tokes]

Why, why, why would you want to run multiple pumps?

So that if one pump fails, you only have half the volume and your engine keeps running and you nuke it? I'd rather rely on one, and god forbid it happens to crap out the engine should just cut out, instead of running horridly lean.

Lots of domestic guys have been running one fuel pump for years and years.. I think you just like the idea of overspending for the sake of over spending. You'll sink tons and tons into over priced HKS Type-R oil coolers and septuple fuel pumps that you'll never finish your build.

Magnafuel makes good stuff, I say roll with it.

[NismoS-tune]

Why, why, why would you want to run multiple pumps?

So that if one pump fails, you only have half the volume and your engine keeps running and you nuke it? I'd rather rely on one, and god forbid it happens to crap out the engine should just cut out, instead of running horridly lean.

Lots of domestic guys have been running one fuel pump for years and years.. I think you just like the idea of overspending for the sake of over spending. You'll sink tons and tons into over priced HKS Type-R oil coolers and septuple fuel pumps that you'll never finish your build.

Magnafuel makes good stuff, I say roll with it.

You're probably, right, I'll spend 50k and just part out cause it's an old beast that's slower than a corvette lol. It's been 5 long years of hard driving and no major issues though. how's your car running?

Anyways, I thought the serious guys ran multi pump systems with fail safes (like when you blow a MAF?!?!) to the tune to keep it rich. Maybe I'll just stick to my tomei fuel pump and call it a day. I'm only planning on running a few 100hp per L.

About the "running lean with 1 less pump that's true if you don't know your pump fails but with the low pressure switch that tells you about low pressure could affect your tune... Like the ancient "MAF malfuntion, 2000rpm limit and WOT fuel map. It was just an idea. I see multi pump setups often that work well.

Maybe I'll stick to one pump and safe some cash for other parts

I see many respectable GTRs with dual pumps or more on SAU and that site has massive amounts of knowledge for GTRs. I'm a sucker for following the winners lol.

[JD74]

It's been 5 long years of hard driving and no major issues though. how's your car running?

[tokes]

Just as well.

The fact that my OEM motor blew up, or that my motor with good internals (y'know, wiseco, ARP, tomei, ACL, gredy, and nissan stuff) blew up becuse it was assembled/machined poorly doesn't have anything to do with overspending for an oil cooler/filter, or wanting to run a $4000 fuel system with, as JD mentioned, 40 thousand AN fittings.

Some people get lucky with engines like you, qualthar, or a few others on here, some people like me get **** luck.