RB20DET Headers a good plan?

[Steaver]

Hey guys,

Thinking about putting some headers on my RB20DET but I don't know what parts I will need. As far as I know I will just need 1) the header, 2) gaskets, and 3) the hardware? I expected it to be a somewhat expensive mod but after looking around online a little bit I have found that it will only be around $200? Is this.... right? I don't want to be buying a piece of garbage. And if this is actually right then does anyone know what kind of gains to expect HP and torque wise? I've been looking around and I cant seem to find much info on them. I might just be looking in the wrong places :P

I've found a couple places that seem to be good I think. I'll link them at the bottom. Any input on if this is a good idea and if there are any parts or is work that I might not expect, that way I don't get it and find out I have to pay a grand to get it installed if I cant do it. :P

Thanks,
Seaver.

http://www.cxracing.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CXR&Product_Code=MF-RB20DET-TOP&Category_Code=

(also, on the above link, are the options with the check boxes actually adding a turbo and or wastegate??.... seems cheap)

http://www.racinginnovationandsupply.com/Nissan-Skyline-Exhaust-RB20-RB25-Header_p_215.html

[Supraclean]

If you check around gtrc and search rb20 manifold you should come up with results.

Basicly the cheap $200 -$400 manifold like obx, godspeed, cxracing will most likely need to be modified in some sort of way.

It might be bolts holes/ wastegate positioning or turbo flange bracing.

If it were me Id choose what I want from my engine/ turbo choices. Alot of $$$ can get wrapped up in manifold swaps.

Google 6boost, fullrace, Doc, rawbrokerage manifolds, yea they might be expensive but there worth it.

[Skym]

Not needed unless tracking car where you'll get the most from that mod (mid to high rpm). Headers make transient response slower (longer distance for exhaust gas to travel before hitting exhaust wheel on turbo), engine loses hp down low but gains more mid to high hp and 1psi or more lower boost level (depends on exhaust housing, turbo used). You'll need a ECU tune to match as engine goes leaner (less exhaust gas rentering cylinders thus cleaner burn / more oxygen allowed into cylinders) which makes engine produce more hp. HP gains (going off what happens on SR20DET, but usually similar result on RB20DET) can be around 12hp from memory.

I would suggest to do boost up mods, cams (Tomei Poncams) before trying to change exhaust manifold (last mod you do and that's with a bigger turbo upgrade, etc).

[garetth]

Like the others said an aftermarket manifold is not needed unless your going for a top mount or looks. If you do decide to go with an upgrade I'd recommend getting one of Ebay and having your welder clean up any bad welds.

[Steaver]

AWESOME. This is exactly the kind of info and help I was looking for. I had thought about cams a little while back but I had sort of just dropped the idea. Don't know why. Also, what is a good but not top of the line boost controller? And what is a decent number for psi on a stock turbo with the boost controller installed? AND. Who would be a good person to see to get to go over my car and let me know what has all been done to it? The idiot I bought the car off of didn't know anything about cars in general. He bought the car to rip around in, got bored and sold it. -_- such a nice guy.

[Skym]

Others can advise on who to see, but with Skylines (performance car) it's best to consult a tuner (who tunes, maintains performance cars, racecars, etc), not a normal mechanic. Skylines have to be treated similar to racecars with servicing, etc when modified and used on racetrack, road, etc. Like any car, if you service car properly it can be very reliable, but if you don't, can run into problems (part failure).

If bought car and don't know service history, would advise to change all fluids (engine oil with 10w40 + Nismo oilfilter, gearbox fluid from Nissan, diffhead fluid from Nissan, power steering fluid from Nissan, coolant change with coolant from Nissan + flush cooling system, heater core, overflow bottle and clean / rod out radiator core of crap that builds up, change thermostat with new stock thermostat, change brake fluid with 600+ boiling point brake fluid from Motul, etc), change fuelfilter, sparkplugs, change airfilter in stock airbox, check brake pads, rotors for wear on front and rear of car, change brake hoses (change them every 4 years or so), check tyre wear, 4 wheel alignment, grease door, hood, trunk hinges, etc.

Boost up mods for around 330hp at 14.5psi -

FMIC (Front Mount InterCooler)
550cc Deatschwerks injectors
255lph Deatschwerks fuelpump
Deatschwerks hardwire kit
Nistune for stock ECU
NGK PFR6A or PFR7A with 0.8mm gap (let tuner choose which sparkplug is best).
Upgraded clutch
Electronic boost controller
BOV
3" exhaust from turbo

Optional but recommended -

Engine oilcooler

Cheaper non Japanese made boost controllers don't come with filters (filters need to be changed every 5000kms as part of routine maintenance) to protect solenoid, MAP sensor. Basically you might be replacing solenoid, controller which has map sensor built in on some cheaper boost controllers often if buy a cheaper boost controller (it's one of the reasons why they are cheap). Apexi, HKS, etc boost controllers have the filters.

I would concentrate on servicing and getting car to a point where it's reliable before modifying it.

[Steaver]

Yeah that was actually my plan. As soon as spring rolls around, I'm going to take it out of storage, and get ALL the fluids replaced, along with the thermostat. Also, I am still having those engine bogging issues. Turns out its completely temperature related, so me and a few other people have been talking about it and were fairly sure that the issue is the thermostat having issues. So my list of stuff to do ASAP is change the thermostat and all the fluids and hopefully I will have the engine issue solved. Then new paint on the body and spoiler (I just bought the R32 GT-R spoiler) and get my rims powder coated black.

And for the WONDERFUL list of mods you listed, the only thing my car doesn't have as far as I know, is the boost controller. Like I said, the guy I bought it off of didn't know a whole lot, so it could have the injectors and fuel pump from one of the REAL owners before him, but I really don't know. I haven't taken the time to look yet.

[Skym]

The bogging is normal, as stock ECU will do that up to around 3000rpm and up to certain coolant temp. It's just the ECU pulling ignition timing, etc when engine is warming up (protect's engine during warmup and I think matches ignition timing to engine running rich). It would require Nistune for stock ECU to adjust the ignition timing, fuel when engine is warming up (would be out of tune on modified engine and probably require more ignition timing to stop it bogging).

I just warm engine up for around 9-10 minutes on the spot (gets to coolant temp where ECU won't make engine bog), then carefully drive for 1-2km (the bog on my car is hardly noticable). Same thing they do with racecars. For some people this is not possible and only warmup for few minutes.

Also add 1.2mm, 80.5mm metal headgasket, Nissan repair gasket kit, ARP head studs, etc to that list (330hp is at engine) for reliability on racetrack and do a compression, leak down test before boosting up stock engine with stock headgasket.

The Group-A racing version of RB20DET (RB20DET-R) with similar mods (RB20DET-R has a bigger T3/To4E turbo, equal length extractors, FMIC) would be around 381rwhp, which is over 400hp at engine.

This is the Group-A racing version of RB20DET (RB20DET-R) in racing trim (around 500hp at engine) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIasNcIrZcM

RB20DET is known for the sound with Group-A equal length exhaust manifold, turbo, etc.

R32 RB20DET can sound similar with copy Group-A equal length exhaust manifold, HKS2535 turbo, etc (R32 RB20DET with 330hp vs 650hp R32 GTR) -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dc_3Zb4zbU4

Copy of Group-A equal length exhaust manifold cost's around 2-3k.

If run engine on E85 with E85 compatible fuel system + ECU tune to suit, you can get roughly another 50hp at same boost level.

[Steaver]

No it's not that kind of bogging. Like I've had other posts on here in summer trying to fix it. I'll link the other forum as a refresh in case you have had any new ideas. But the tuning might be a good idea. I really don't know what this cars history is because it has had so many owners in Canada. As in at least 4-5 before me. But I did end up finding who tuned it. its a company from BC. I think it was called "Stay Tuned"? Can't remember who off the top of my head. How difficult or expensive is it to get a nistune done?

Also, what is your opinion on E3 spark plugs?

[Steaver]

http://forums.gtrcanada.com/gts-tech/56525-bogging-4000rm-when-warm.html

AND

http://forums.gtrcanada.com/gts-tech/56773-auto-trans-ecu-manual.html

AND

http://forums.gtrcanada.com/gts-tech/55953-hesitation-sputtering-well-engine-light-flickering-under-wot.html

These 3 are all about my car.

[Skym]

Sometimes bogging (on my car it was the pipe infront of turbo that had intake hose clamp that was loose on turbo side) is due to intake piping airleaks (loose intake hose clamps) or joiners have gone hard due to heat and are not sealing properly.

Sounds like a chip done on computer without car (probably still has stock warmup tables, etc).

If stock ECU is chipped it should have a 28 pin EPROM socket installed, so remove 28 pin EPROM chip and fit Nistune board (has stock maps on it) into 28 pin socket. Then solder cable into main circuit board and connect plug to Nistune board.

Here's how Nistune board is installed -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvdvyg5tnw8

E3 sparkplugs, never heard of them. I use NGK sparkplugs that were designed to be used with stock head.

[Steaver]

alright il get someone to check into the leaks in spring. but it could also be that it needs to be re-tuned?

[Skym]

Could be. One way to tell is to buy Nistune tuning software + Consult cable they sell + Nistune board, etc and use Nistune software + laptop + Consult cable to download the maps on ECU you have now and compare to stock tune in ROM pack. If they are the same, you have your answer.

[Steaver]

Do you know what the stock thermostat could be replaced with? Does Nissan make a replacement? Or would it be the same as a 300ZX? Or is there a cross reference number that could be used?

[Skym]

There are cheaper aftermarket thermostat's, but stock Nissan thermostat is best (reliable).

Part number for thermostat is mentioned here (scroll down in link below) -

http://www.cockramnissan.co.nz/shop/thermostats/petrol-thermostats/