NEED HELP! Documentary on the safety of RHD on the Roads

[doublejceballos]

hi
i didnt read all the pages on this thread
however i was wondering did you post this on http://forum.ivoac.ca/

[JD74]

I more or less agree with JD74 here...Minimum age and experience would be a good idea. I realize that there are good, responsible younger drivers, but that doesn't mean anything. Experience counts for a lot. I also wouldn't mind seeing additional training being required. Not just for RHD vehicles but also exotics and other non standard road cars. Drivers training in Canada is a bit of a joke...

If I have to get behind a cause that punishes younger and sometimes inexperienced drivers (16-18-19?) in order to save my own @ss......I will do it in a heart-beat.

Let's face it here guys, although the young guys are going to chime in any minute and RAGE, they should all be used to getting the 'shaft', as that is what being young is all about (we have all been there)......

The finer things in life come with Age and Experience (boobs, beer, cheaper insurance....you know)....and this shouldn't be any different.

It's just another milestone for a younger person to reach as well as an experience level to achieve during the Road through Life ......lol

[chuckycheese]

You all have valid points and thoughts to consider. I usually don't get involved in these types of discussions, but this is a good cause and the powers that be have way to many double standards.
I have been fighting for this cause for almost 7 years now, before the right hand drives came to being legal here. I had created a list of issues and possible fixes and had arranged meetings between Kevin F* and others at transport canada. Like you would think he never showed and sent in a office flunky to represent him. I came armed with a representative of Nissan, a professional collision repairman and bodyshop (ICBC acredited shop owner), a known vehicle importer as well. All our ideas and thoughts were thrown out. The top of my list is the last issue you all have raised with new drivers and age. It is a large double standard that we face on our roads if you look at it purely in the experience-horsepower-risk exposure for cars to say motorcycles.
Graduated programs where drivers earn the right to more advanced rides is how bikes differ. Our question was why are cars different? Anyone with enough money can buy all the horsepower they want when they get a license. Is this the start of the problem?
My partners came to the conclusion sensible equal-level rules should be applied, but why aren't they? Violations for MAJOR breaches in these cars operation under learning level licenses should be meaningful as well. The cars are not the culprits.
Yes, the manufacturers are not likeing lower priced cars comming into being here and the vendors are mad as well that the curbing (private selling) of the cars is not being monitored by the motor dealers association (MDA). They feel it is leaving too much exposure of the un informed buyers of the market. Most people I know , do a fair bit of homework on jumping into these before purchase. We all know the joys and woes of fixing these cars all-the-time!
The biggest problems I first had to fight many years ago was ICBC air-care. They were absolutely convinced that no JDM turbo engine would pass the air care. I had mine on the dyno and surrounded by senoir management in Northvan years ago to watch as I hopefully failed. I passed with flying colors. I even passed the tollerances for california as well as I knew the needed readings. I made sure this was presented to them at that time. I had long previosly done that with my first Sr20DET motor 10 years ago. I have doubled the power and still pass (helpfully with stand-alone).
Technology exists to allow the cars to meet most standards, they are just making it near impossible to allow us to do the conversions. Even when I have done the conversions they still try to say they fail- even though their measuring equipment prove they work fine (such as re&re headlights) as I have done for R34's etc.
I hope this works for you guys and I applaud your dilligence in doing this video. My hat goes off to you for the effort. I really am in this for the joy of these cars and the frienship with fellow owners. If we all stay as a tight group without internal squabbling and present the rights of all-canadian drivers fairly, hopefully things will be heard.
Good luck all!

[super_joel7]

hi
i didnt read all the pages on this thread
however i was wondering did you post this on http://forum.ivoac.ca/

I will right now.

if i were you i'd try to approach this with some caution and research.

do not appeal to emotion. use reasonable, verifiable arguments.

back up your arguments with DATA.

consider the other side of the debate and invalidate their arguments. (again, use data).

consider compromises. be prepared to concede certain aspects that ARE undeniably unsafe about RHD vehicles in RHT.


if you only make the thing into some brain dead video full of people saying "i have a right to drive what i want", and "RHD are perfectly safe, I drive one every day" etc., the whole thing will be glossed over and ignored.

it will turn into a farce like most of the RHD-defending initiatives thus far.

Will do, Thanks for the advice.

You can interview me for some difference in opinion since all these fan boys are lost in the allure of being "cool" with their unsafe Skylines.

Thanks. It would have to be through email as I cant get cameras to Alberta hah.

you should come out to our weekly thursday meets and talk to the guys. check out the western area threads as we update every week.

I will start coming.


I didnt mean to start a huge **** storm. sorry guys.


Are there any shops owners that would volunteer to be interviewed in BC?

[starboy869]

Not hard to tell you don't give a shyt because you already have yours.

I do give a ****. I just hate the fan boys who with there busted ,rusted out, black smoking, P.O.S. RHD whatever thinking they're cool. Also there's a lot of JUNK entering the country. A few years ago $15k for a GTR was common. Now $10k is avg.


I'm all for going back to the 25 years importing rule.

http://www.tigerautoparts.com/autoparts.php?category=36

Not a single one over 10k

[M-SPEC]

Personally I think two 3000+ lbs chunks of steel filled with combustible petroleum products heading straight for each other and missing the other one by 4ft is pretty freaking dangerous RHD or LHD. Yet millions of people get up every morning and play this crazy game. If that is not insane enough you can walk on a sidewalk 2ft away these projectiles with no protection from them ...... some times people over analyze things

One thing I agree with is we need way better driver training in Canada, perhaps even a progressive licence like a racing licence, meaning you can drive a non performance stock car (under 250HP) with a regular licence but if you wanted a performance car you had to go to advanced driver training program and get the next stage (stage II) of licensing up to 400HP cars. Then perhaps an stage III licence for cars 400HP + for exotics and modified cars

[super_joel7]

Update.

Adam Grossman, who is the senior media relations advisor for ICBC has agreed to be interviewed and help out. So that is a step in the right direction.

What is the license system like in Austraila? I remember reading somewhere that you had to have your license for a while before you could drive a turbo car or something.

[M-SPEC]

You should look into what they have to do in Germany or Finland to get the licence
..... pretty tough

Congrats on getting an interview with Mr Grossman ... be sure to ask him about their made up 40% study lol

[MikeRWK]

You have you're P-Plates for a few years then u get to drive turbo cars and other high performance rigs, goto skylinesaustralia.com you'll get some good info.

[Oakville]

ahh this is true^ whenever I was there Id always see these small cars with the P-plate, similar to the N sticker. I think we should have that kind of program out here in Ontario

[tazsgtr]

I don't think that the words "safe" or "unsafe", "dangerous" or "non-dangerous" belong in any discussion of whether RHD vehicles are permitted. For North American Roads, RHD vehicles are more difficult to drive and require more skill and much more common sense.

Saying that RHD vehicles are unsafe is the equivalent of saying bicycles and motorcycles are unsafe as they provide less protection in a collision. Smart cars and minis are unsafe in that they are not visible and possibly provide less protection than an SUV. Suvs are unsafe as they are top heavy and prone to roll overs. Young drivers are unsafe as they lack the experience dealing with traffic and how the car reacts.

[mcfly]

I don't think that the words "safe" or "unsafe", "dangerous" or "non-dangerous" belong in any discussion of whether RHD vehicles are permitted. For North American Roads, RHD vehicles are more difficult to drive and require more skill and much more common sense.

Saying that RHD vehicles are unsafe is the equivalent of saying bicycles and motorcycles are unsafe as they provide less protection in a collision. Smart cars and minis are unsafe in that they are not visible and possibly provide less protection than an SUV. Suvs are unsafe as they are top heavy and prone to roll overs. Young drivers are unsafe as they lack the experience dealing with traffic and how the car reacts.

They are more dangerous then lhd cars because of the obvious visibility issues

[JD74]

I don't think that the words "safe" or "unsafe", "dangerous" or "non-dangerous" belong in any discussion of whether RHD vehicles are permitted. For North American Roads, RHD vehicles are more difficult to drive and require more skill and much more common sense.

North American roads are built to accomodate LHD vehicles - it's an argument you will NEVER win. RHD vehicles ARE DANGEROUS on NA Roads due to lack of visibility, especially when crossing lanes, such as a left hand turn into oncoming traffic. Done and Done.

Saying that RHD vehicles are unsafe is the equivalent of saying bicycles ....blah...blah...unsafe ..blah....blah.

It's funny you should mention that. Here in Calgary, Bicycles are BANNED from Deerfoot Trail because of safety due to the road being design to accomodate high speed traffic.

We have to be realistic......and having your @ss lift completely off your seat while leaning over into the left seat for better visibility while negotiating a left hand turn is NOT an answer to skill or not.

LOL...

[Turismo]

North American roads are built to accomodate LHD vehicles - it's an argument you will NEVER win. RHD vehicles ARE DANGEROUS on NA Roads due to lack of visibility, especially when crossing lanes, such as a left hand turn into oncoming traffic. Done and Done.

I agree completely that our roads are not designed to accommodate RHD vehicles but to go as far to say they are "dangerous" i feel is too far. Aside from the visibility issue there is no other reason that makes them less safe, or "dangerous." one could easily argue that a motorcycle is as dangerous for the same lack of visibility issues. It puts responsibility on the driver to accommodate themselves to overcome such issue.

Even transport canada has felt no need to ban RHD vehicles for many many years. It's not like the first RHD cars started showing up in 1989 for the first time ever because of skylines. There has been an obvious surge since then, but it just proves that the person behind the wheel is ultimately at fault. Not the car.

[christdeyoung]

Personally I think two 3000+ lbs chunks of steel filled with combustible petroleum products heading straight for each other and missing the other one by 4ft is pretty freaking dangerous RHD or LHD. Yet millions of people get up every morning and play this crazy game. If that is not insane enough you can walk on a sidewalk 2ft away these projectiles with no protection from them ...... some times people over analyze things

One thing I agree with is we need way better driver training in Canada, perhaps even a progressive licence like a racing licence, meaning you can drive a non performance stock car (under 250HP) with a regular licence but if you wanted a performance car you had to go to advanced driver training program and get the next stage (stage II) of licensing up to 400HP cars. Then perhaps an stage III licence for cars 400HP + for exotics and modified cars

lol....I've thought of this before. It'll be one of those things that we did in the past, and now that we look back we say 'omg that is so unsafe, how could they be so stupid....etc'.

But yes...people are making a mountain out of a molehill here. Its not that big of a deal to drive a RHD in North America. Yes....its more dangerous. But no the difference is NOT night and day...don't even fukkin worry about it unless you're a complete useless cake, and/or have irresponsible driving habits.
Defensive driving is defensive driving! USE IT ALWAYS