edited by S
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Lug nuts - serious buziness :)
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I use rays. I liked the wheel lock design looking pretty Much like the rest of the lugs.“Hey, come on, its a car right? No. It’s a symbol of your history, its a thread of continuity from which you came to where you are. It’s important that you don’t want to forget who you are.” -Dr.Phil in "Love the Beast"
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Anyone run Mutekis? I'm not sure if they'd be better than my Gorillas which need constant torquing at the track.
PS: From an engineering standpoint, I would run OEM to only lightly harder alloy for OEM studs. You want the nut threads do to the work and fatigue, not the other way around.1992 BNR32 SKYLINE GTR
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Originally posted by Marus92 View PostSo, I gather your job at TWM is going well? :P
they are going to be officially unveilled this week, we still need to confirm the options we'll be giving
for sure i'm running these on my GTR as soon as the first batch comes in, they are going to be great for the track
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Originally posted by StardustSorry, I didn't get this. Are you saying that to use aftermarket nuts you need to replace the oem studs first? What do you mean you want nut threads to work and fatigue? You realize what happens if the nut thread gives up due to fatigue - your wheels will fall off. But again, may be I misunderstood. I am sparky, lol We don't speak "mechanical eng" language, haha
stronger studs don't really exist so by using better nuts, its safer
studs and nuts aren't designed to fail, like a shear pin, they should hold as much force as possible
if you upgrade your nuts, then the stud becomes the weak link, but the threashold is still higher than if you were using a normal nut
so, if you'd have a stud/nut combo that could hold 10x times the force of the standard units, it would be best, there is no downside!
you DON'T want your stud/nuts to fail, anytime anywhere !
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Originally posted by Stardustwhen you say - better nuts - what do you mean by "better"? If we compare hardened steel aftermarket nut to ordinary factory steel nut - how do we know that aftermarket is "better" and not just a gimmick?
Also, could you please comment on the following statement (source: Rays engineering) - lug nuts are made with tapered bottoms and are not recommended for use on the factory rims." Why?
if you buy 6061 aluminum nuts (duralumin, by rays) know that it is the weakest material used to make nuts
and in any case, aluminum is a poor material to use in fatigue situations
and if you tend to remove your wheels often (like i do, because i do alot of track) then the threads of aluminum nuts will wear out at light speed, i usually spend no more than 2 season with the same set
OE manufacturers use standard carbon steel, which is strong but heavy,
if you want to upgrade with steel, the only way to go is with a steel alloy like Chromoly, its the same weight as any other steel, but over twice as strong, so the nut can be made smaller-lighter
the advantage of Titanium, is that its even stronger than chromoly, and half the weight, also, it does not rust, at all, and it is extremely wear resistant
aftermarket nuts should mostly be used with aftermarket wheels, because the 60deg taper is standardized across all A/M manufacturer, but not with OE wheels
thats why they put a disclamer, so you don't return them if they don't fit your OE wheels
also, hardened steel is simply a standard carbon steel that is heat treater for a harder surface, for better wear resistance, but its not actually stronger
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Originally posted by StardustOn stock rims or on the aftermarket? Do you track your car? Do you use regular or extended nuts? Open or closed end? Need more info please
In my 3 years of working on audis I have never seen a bolt aftermarket or oem break, nor a stud fail when properly torqued by an accurate wrench and in the correct pattern. The only time I've ever seen wheels fall off or nuts/studs fail are from apparent cross threading, no torquing whatsoever, this includes countless rs models and r8's which many run aftermarket wheels.
If you stick to the correct seat pattern for your wheels, proper torque with a torque wrench, not a stick (too tight is also bad), in the correct star sequence you won have a problem. Retorque the wheels after a full drive cycle if your anal and obviously before hard driving for peace of mind.
^ as for frankiman, I would never use any sort of paste or grease on a wheel fastener whatsoever, this is in regards to torquing numbers with and without lubrication. This is a rule taught from ITA government programs, and I stick by it. Everyone has there own methods but personally I have to stick with what is considered proper practice by trades authorities. In the event a customers wheel comes off and they are injured I would be considered liable for malpractice.Last edited by caliber676; 03-17-2013, 09:22 PM.“Hey, come on, its a car right? No. It’s a symbol of your history, its a thread of continuity from which you came to where you are. It’s important that you don’t want to forget who you are.” -Dr.Phil in "Love the Beast"
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Originally posted by caliber676 View Post^ as for frankiman, I would never use any sort of paste or grease on a wheel fastener whatsoever, this is in regards to torquing numbers with and without lubrication. This is a rule taught from ITA government programs, and I stick by it. Everyone has there own methods but personally I have to stick with what is considered proper practice by trades authorities. In the event a customers wheel comes off and they are injured I would be considered liable for malpractice.
it won't make the parts unscrew by themselves, it will simply keep them from "cold welding"
i always use grease on all the bolts on my car when putting them back together, wheel nuts too, haven't lost a nut at the track yet
and i've always used anti-seize on the brake calipers bolts, they are always tight, but super easy to take off
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^ i agree with them not coming apart, I'm sure there is next to no risk of using lube. Just trying to show another side of the paper. In "proper practice" your supposed to stay away from using anti seize/lubricants in certain places.
For the duraluminum lugs they do tend to bind a bit, but I see enough bolting and unbolting keep it down to a minimum.
I think a lot of people see videos like the rx7's wheels falling off and think it is a common thing that needs serious thought. I'd say its almost always human error for those types of failure, and of course if your running $10 lugs from ebay I'd still place that under the human error category“Hey, come on, its a car right? No. It’s a symbol of your history, its a thread of continuity from which you came to where you are. It’s important that you don’t want to forget who you are.” -Dr.Phil in "Love the Beast"
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Originally posted by caliber676 View Post^ i agree with them not coming apart, I'm sure there is next to no risk of using lube. Just trying to show another side of the paper. In "proper practice" your supposed to stay away from using anti seize/lubricants in certain places.
For the duraluminum lugs they do tend to bind a bit, but I see enough bolting and unbolting keep it down to a minimum.
I think a lot of people see videos like the rx7's wheels falling off and think it is a common thing that needs serious thought. I'd say its almost always human error for those types of failure, and of course if your running $10 lugs from ebay I'd still place that under the human error category
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