Accu-sump good or bad and why ?

[jdms13rhd]

this is true. They are kinda large and not so easy to install. My engine bay doesnt have much in there so easy for me, but a street GTR on the other hand, that is a task to consider. Im thinking the borg location would be one of the only conventional locations and still needs modification. I suppose you can make a shield or wrap it in something or make a grill of some sorts.

Borg pix:








Here is something like I was thinking. This is my friends GTO. Either like this or under my dash some place.

[NismoS-tune]

There's always behind the seat on the floor or in the trunk with $200 worth of hose lol.

[GTR-Dad]

Gtr-dad was saying he did one hard track day on a stock engine and the next day had rod knock..

That was at autoX with OE oilpan and, as far as I know, no sump baffle. Lateral G's peaked at 1.2 that day and the course had a fairly long fast curve so there was plenty of time for oil to run away from the pickup. Coincidence? Perhaps, but it was the first track day with new suspension and more lateral G's.

It'd take a good sized accumlator to fill in more than a brief oil interruption. If anyone knows the displacement of a pump you could work out how much flow it's got at speed and then work out how long an accumlator would cover you. I'm guessing about 1/4 - 1/2 second. Oil accumulators are great for 'pre-lubing' your engine during cold starts, but I would go with something more positive for serious tracking.

I've put many hard track miles on my car in the last few years without a hint of oil trouble. I'm running a Nismo pump, tomei orifice, tomei sump baffle, and fully topped (but not overfilled) oil level. I'm also running nothing stickier than Direzza Star Specs. An experienced guy I ran into at a driving school observed that wet sumped, turbo charged cars and sticky tires are not a good combination.

I'm planning a preventative rebuild this winter and will be considering oiling options to give me the courage to run race rubber.

I think Marke has done a fair bit of track time with sticky rubber. Any feedback Marke? Oil system? Tires?

Dan

[NismoS-tune]

Dan, what do you have in mind for a "preventative rebuild"? You've found signs of fatigue with your current setup? By sticky tires, are you talking about going R compounds? If you have not had any issues at all, why are you thinking of more oiling options? More peace of mind?

[jdms13rhd]

It'd take a good sized accumlator to fill in more than a brief oil interruption. If anyone knows the displacement of a pump you could work out how much flow it's got at speed and then work out how long an accumlator would cover you. I'm guessing about 1/4 - 1/2 second. Oil accumulators are great for 'pre-lubing' your engine during cold starts, but I would go with something more positive for serious tracking.
Dan

On the accusump site it claims considerably longer times. Im sure its a little vague, but within 5-10 seconds or so. I figured the Moroso unit should be comparable.

"After the engine is started and the oil pump has taken over, oil is pumped back into the Accusump. This moves the piston back and pressurizes the Accusump until it equalizes with engine's oil pressure. While driving, if the engine's oil pressure is interrupted for any reason, the Accusump releases its oil reserve again, keeping the engine lubricated until the engine's oil pressure comes back to normal. This release of oil could last from 15 to 60 seconds, depending on the size and speed of the engine."

Link: http://www.accusump.com/accusump_tech.html

[GTR-Dad]

Dan, what do you have in mind for a "preventative rebuild"? You've found signs of fatigue with your current setup? By sticky tires, are you talking about going R compounds? If you have not had any issues at all, why are you thinking of more oiling options? More peace of mind?

I've got a bit of blowby and the odd blue puff that doesn't make a bunch of sense. There's been a bit of oil finding its way into the coolant since day 1 as well. This has been going on for some time, and I'd rather not have the car schedule a rebuild for me.

I've limited myself to street tires for fear of causing oil problems. R comps are a logical progression to going faster.

Allen,
5 or 10 seconds of emergency oil supply would be great. I'll have to find out how much flow the pump makes, what volume is stored in the acculator, and do some math. The experience that makes me sceptical is when my oil filter seal failed on cold startup. At idle rpm it puked about 2 litres of oil on my garage floor in about 10 seconds. (Estimated numbers) I figure if I was at 6000 rpm about 12 litres would have flowed in the same timeframe. That's a lot of oil to feed into the system if the pump isn't pumping.

Dan

[jdms13rhd]

Dan,
You know, before I went to bed last night I was thinking the same thing. I once started a Sr back in the day with no turbo on it and had a liter go on the floor pretty quickly. Also there is a 1.5qt and a 3 qt and then the same sizes but heavy duty. Not sure what the heavy duty ones have different inside them? Maybe a spring or something? Also, I bet being a domestic company, they use those numbers for a V8 which doesnt rev as high as our 4 and 6cyl's. So it is a pretty vague number with that said. Id like to know more of an approx number too. Might be that it slowly supplies just enough oil for the bearings to not run dry cuz I have my doubt that it wont push the same volume as an oil pump. Im not apposed to the idea. Still could help considerably depending on the situation and I liked the idea of a wet start.

[GTR-Dad]

Yep. Definitely can't hurt, but doesn't replace a dry sump, etc.

[Skym]

Probably wouldn't use a standard oilfilter on racecar. Royal Purple oilfilter is rated to 600psi vs 260psi?? from standard oilfilter, as shown via test videoclip in this thread below and review by independant source videoclip that measures the oilfilter housing thickness, etc when they pulled one apart -

http://forums.gtrcanada.com/general-skyline-discussion/43773-oil-filter.html

It's something I'm considering moving to, as backing plate, housing are stronger, etc. With a higher pressure oilpump, probably a good idea.

[Dragon Humper]

I am running an accusump on my ceffy I am in the middle of building right now. I think its a good addition to a build for any kind of track use. I was building my engine for only track use but changed my mind recently to take it on the street every now and then to show off and wash it ect.

Here is what I did to mine and a cost referance to show an approx price for a reliable set up imo.

1. Crank collar $200
2. crank collar install with grub screw $80
3. N1 oil pump $? Forget what I paid. Was a while ago. guess $280
4. I am going with a 1.4mm restrictor $30
5. -10 head drain $60
6. tomei baffle plate $160
7. 1.5qt Moroso $paid $200 at mopac.
8. Already had a greddy oil coller kit. So whatever one of those cost. Lets say $300ish
9. port match OEM oil drain. Cost is nothing
10. Smooth block castings. cost is nothing
11. Only thing I need to do is buy the fittings, valve and line for the attachment of the accusump to the oilcooler line and the head drain. I am doing a split on my head drain. one to each side in -10. Not too sure what I will pay for all that stuff. Random number $350.

That's a fine setup, the unit you have though is the 3 quart one, not the 1.5 quart. Just a heads up to everyone that the 1.5 quart does not have a piston in it and can only be mounted in a vertical position (purchased one by mistake, deemed hokey, sent it back). The piston type can be mounted anywhere in any place you can find.

Another heads up, NHRA will never let you mount it in the pass. compartment, no oil, fuel, batterys (unless in an approved enclosure) or anything that could explode in your face.




Jon.

[NismoS-tune]

The 2 quart accusump I bought back in January didn't say any specific way to mount it so I'm guessing anything over 1.5Q can be mounted any way.

[jdms13rhd]

ya, kinda weird. All the moroso instructions say mount in any position. I do have the 1.5 qt. The moroso site doesnt say what size for part number. I followed the sites recommendations and got the moroso 23901. I knew it was a 1.5qt to begin with. Its still in the box and got the recept still so figured before I get going on the build was going to exchange it for the 3qt anyways. But I didnt know anything about no piston in the 1.5qt. Doesnt make much sense it is different tho. I'll have to call moroso and ask. Need to call them anyways as their push/pull battery kit is bogas and doesnt come with the parts to even make it work. PN# 74105. another heads up I guess.

Dont think Ill be at the drags anyways. I'll check scca rules too in case I decide to race in their events before I jump into mounting it in the cabin. Drifting series is no worries

[Dragon Humper]

They might have done away with that particular model. It was basicly a bottle with an NPT fitting at one end, you mount it vertically, the oil would force it's way in compressing the air. When you needed the pressurized oil the compressed air would force the oil out (it's heavier than the air and at the bottom).

Like I said, hokey. The piston type is the only way to go. A 1.5 quart would be small enough to mount in a bunch of places, but you will give up some time till empty.



Edit: nope, they still make it, avoid this one, it's poop.

http://www.jegs.com/i/Moroso/710/23930/10002/-1

Jon.

[jdms13rhd]

ya, mine looks nothing like that. If I can find out how long approx my 1.5 takes to empty I'll keep it, but I got lots of room in my engine bay and in the car so I should upgrade to the 3qt anyways.

here is mine:

[LIGHTSPD]

I have used an installed accusump in many vehicles over the years set up properly they will provide oil pressure on initial startup but more so extra pressure on demand. The only thing I would do different is to enable it only on startup and only above a certain RPM. The reason for that is for the automatic system you need to pick a pressure for release well most vehicles idle under the pressure you would want so I would use my ECU to control that window a little more. Otherwise the constant clicking of the solenoid will drive you batty in a very short time. We buy only Canton Accusump mainly because well they were first and have an exceptional product as well as one of their dealers I find their tech support excellent. One thing to remember use good fittings a simple leak will make 3 L of mess LOL.